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peekaboo

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Sorry if this topic is redundant but I'm just really having a hard time with clarity regarding the donations.

 

VIP account - I don't really think the manual effect is needed on a HR server, would be better if it was BBG effect. If BBG has been removed from the server then ignore this suggestion.

> The monthly headgears channels my inner woman too much are there going to be any male headgears added?

 

Buffer - Basically a buffer for donating. Don't need FCP just regular buffs.

 

Unlimited stuff - Elemental Convertors/ Bottles/ Boxes. Only for PvE not PvP/ WOE.

Edited by peekaboo

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Bubblegum isn't available on the server, so it'd be a bit much to add it to VIP accounts. We decided not to offer it because the drop rates were customized specifically to make things a bit harder than most SHRs (which typically just have 100% drop rates on everything) while still fitting the SHR pace, so adding Bubblegum would have taken away from that goal.

 

For the monthly headgears, we actually are hoping to add another set of them, but the person who was designing the new set for us is having computer issues and we don't have anyone else to draw up some sketches for us at the moment. :( It is something we plan to add though, we just don't currently know when we'll be able to get them.

 

Having a buffer may somewhat hurt support classes in some cases, though I suppose that would also depend on exactly which buffs you were thinking of. Adding Blessing/Increase Agi to the Healer for VIP accounts would probably be fine, though I'm not sure how appealing it would be with just those. It's certainly something we could discuss though.

 

Unlimited items would unfortunately devalue some currencies, which is why we only included an unlimited version of the FCP Scroll and not the other items. We could potentially look at adding a small supplies package to the monthly VIP rewards, though again, that would depend on exactly which items & how many would be given. The main concern would just be the possibility of devaluing other currencies, so as long as it's just a basic package and nothing too big it should be fine, so this would be another one worth discussing and maybe getting some feedback from others for as well.

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Hi again!

 

19 hours ago, peekaboo said:

Buffer - Basically a buffer for donating. Don't need FCP just regular buffs.

I personally don't find this appealing because I can get regular buffs without donating - dual client, ask a HP friend or any HP. Tho I'd like to clarify on what buffs are you referring to?

 

19 hours ago, peekaboo said:

Unlimited stuff - Elemental Convertors/ Bottles/ Boxes. Only for PvE not PvP/ WOE.

The unlimited items that you mentioned would still be used for PvP/WoE purposes. Unless you meant some coding magic to make it PvP/WoE disabled?

 

And as explained by Perry, 

5 minutes ago, Perry the Platypus said:

The main concern would just be the possibility of devaluing other currencies, so as long as it's just a basic package and nothing too big it should be fine, so this would be another one worth discussing and maybe getting some feedback from others for as well.

We would love to get players' suggestions about what could be added to the monthly VIP package!

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1 hour ago, Perry the Platypus said:

Bubblegum isn't available on the server, so it'd be a bit much to add it to VIP accounts. We decided not to offer it because the drop rates were customized specifically to make things a bit harder than most SHRs (which typically just have 100% drop rates on everything) while still fitting the SHR pace, so adding Bubblegum would have taken away from that goal.

 

Having a buffer may somewhat hurt support classes in some cases, though I suppose that would also depend on exactly which buffs you were thinking of. Adding Blessing/Increase Agi to the Healer for VIP accounts would probably be fine, though I'm not sure how appealing it would be with just those. It's certainly something we could discuss though.

 

Unlimited items would unfortunately devalue some currencies, which is why we only included an unlimited version of the FCP Scroll and not the other items. We could potentially look at adding a small supplies package to the monthly VIP rewards, though again, that would depend on exactly which items & how many would be given. The main concern would just be the possibility of devaluing other currencies, so as long as it's just a basic package and nothing too big it should be fine, so this would be another one worth discussing and maybe getting some feedback from others for as well.

 

Regarding the BBG I'm torn simply because I love farming and having to farm for most of the stuff on the server for quests @ 10% drop rate seems cruel. I'm just wasting time waiting for monsters to respawn (I was doing one of the Contracts where you have to farm Yellow Bijou's, I cleared out abyss_03, 10 Acidus in abyss_02 and then had to wait for 2-3 minutes before abyss_03 had mobs). This breaks from the immersion in the game and is not fun.

 

You can add an NPC that just gives the regular Healer NPC buffs, but only have it working during non-WOE times if you feel that it's a competitive edge. 

 

I play alot of subscription based games and so called freemium games so value is something that is of prime concern to me. I just feel if I am giving you my money I have to get the best value for it other wise it's a loss for me.

 

Currently I would be happy to donate for the VIP and some but I am getting (sorry to say this) ugly headgears all of them. Most servers have their Tier 1 HG's for WOE/ PVP/ BG and Tier 2 for Donators, experience boost on a SHR seems redundant. 

 

I don't get what you mean by undervalue? Most of your players are giving currencies to NPC's to buy stuff. Currencies should flow organically within the player base not NPC's. If you did not want to undervalue then you would not have put all the other NPC HG's/ Misc within the Donation NPC. 

 

2 hours ago, Scrub said:

The unlimited items that you mentioned would still be used for PvP/WoE purposes. Unless you meant some coding magic to make it PvP/WoE disabled?

 

As you disable YGG's/ Healing items in WOE/ PvP? There used to be a script/ command where you set restrictions on maps or somewhere in the item DB. Sorry my minds foggy.

 

@Perry the Platypus Please don't diverge from your vision for the server, if it's been working so far it will continue to work. I will continue to play and maybe donate even if what I have suggested doesn't materialize. 

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1 hour ago, peekaboo said:

Regarding the BBG I'm torn simply because I love farming and having to farm for most of the stuff on the server for quests @ 10% drop rate seems cruel. I'm just wasting time waiting for monsters to respawn (I was doing one of the Contracts where you have to farm Yellow Bijou's, I cleared out abyss_03, 10 Acidus in abyss_02 and then had to wait for 2-3 minutes before abyss_03 had mobs). This breaks from the immersion in the game and is not fun.

The main reason for the drop rates being the way they are is it allows for more time investment into each character which, ideally, leads to more activity per player overall. We're still working on a number of new quests and other content to make better use of that, but that is the intent behind it at the very least. Most SHRs get stale quite quickly, and I think having some elements that are a bit more grindy than a typical SHR is something that hopefully helps to set us apart from other servers in that regard.

 

One thing worth noting is, depending on the quests you're doing, you can sometimes adjust your farming accordingly for timed spawns. For example if something has a 10 minute spawn, you can kill those first, then farm the rest of the items so the respawn timer is up by the time you get back. Requires a bit of pre-planning, but it can help speed things up a lot for some quests. :o

 

1 hour ago, peekaboo said:

You can add an NPC that just gives the regular Healer NPC buffs, but only have it working during non-WOE times if you feel that it's a competitive edge. 

I was actually thinking more so for BG/PvP since it's easier to get the buffs immediately before entering, whereas WoE has a bit of travel time. I think it'd only be a competitive edge if the buff list was too long, though; if it's just a few basic buffs then it isn't much different from using a pre-buffer, so it shouldn't be an issue in that case. It'd just be a matter of determining exactly which buffs to use for it. Blessing, Increase Agi, and Impositio Manus seem like the simplest start, but it'd be good to get some feedback on whether or not that would be enough to be appealing.

 

1 hour ago, peekaboo said:

I play alot of subscription based games and so called freemium games so value is something that is of prime concern to me. I just feel if I am giving you my money I have to get the best value for it other wise it's a loss for me.

 

Currently I would be happy to donate for the VIP and some but I am getting (sorry to say this) ugly headgears all of them. Most servers have their Tier 1 HG's for WOE/ PVP/ BG and Tier 2 for Donators, experience boost on a SHR seems redundant. 

The random box is pretty perspective based; personally I like a lot of the headgears in it (though some of them don't fit the styles of my characters, even if I like them), but everyone's tastes are different. Opinions on the experience boost tend to vary as well; some players like it (especially players who played on our previous server, where the rates were 2.5x higher than they are here), others don't see a need for it. We tried to include a few different benefits so there'd be a little something for everyone, but we are always open to improving it of course.

 

As a random aside, a couple other things we're looking at (aside from the new set of monthly headgears) are adding a couple more VIP pets and possibly setting it up to give a forum title/colour (because everyone loves looking fancy). Adding a small supplies box & some other small convenience benefits like buffs from the Healer as you suggested sound like great options as well to give it a bit of a broader appeal for players.

 

1 hour ago, peekaboo said:

I don't get what you mean by undervalue? Most of your players are giving currencies to NPC's to buy stuff. Currencies should flow organically within the player base not NPC's. If you did not want to undervalue then you would not have put all the other NPC HG's/ Misc within the Donation NPC. 

Sorry, I should have clarified that point a bit more. Some of the currencies, such as Poring Coins, are used to buy supplies (acid boxes, Poison Bottles, converters, etc), so having unlimited options would potentially devalue the currencies that are used for those supplies. Having a small supply box with a limited amount would make it easier to mitigate that issue.

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I would suggest not making this a top priority because I'm sure that there are plenty of other things to look at and balance .. Donations are always a gray area in any system .. If you can add Level 10 OC/ DC to all the donation customs that would be a start in the right direction .. Its not game breaking and saves the donator from having to switch characters while buying selling stuff with zeny.

1 hour ago, Perry the Platypus said:

Sorry, I should have clarified that point a bit more. Some of the currencies, such as Poring Coins, are used to buy supplies (acid boxes, Poison Bottles, converters, etc), so having unlimited options would potentially devalue the currencies that are used for those supplies. Having a small supply box with a limited amount would make it easier to mitigate that issue.

 

So does everyone just use poring coins to get bottles? There's a huge miss IMO because if you increase the mob spawn and drop rates for the items that require you to make the bottles (acid, poison, etc) you increase player engagement automatically. 

 

This is just my second day on the server and I am having tons of fun on it .. The first question I asked a friend of mine from a previous server whose recently joined "If you had 50-100$ would you donate to the server" they said "yes". 

 

Servers don't run on TLC .. It requires hard work and getting no thanks and constantly complaining players .. It requires $$ unless you have a inheritance or something .. I'm not saying that make it a cash grab server just make it more appealing for people to willingly give you money .. Make them all costumes .. I'm just looking to make things reasonably easier for you because I've seen far too many good servers close because of lack of funds. Same thing happened on my last server because almost no donators and the owner could not keep up with the costs. 

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4 hours ago, peekaboo said:

I would suggest not making this a top priority because I'm sure that there are plenty of other things to look at and balance .. Donations are always a gray area in any system .. If you can add Level 10 OC/ DC to all the donation customs that would be a start in the right direction .. Its not game breaking and saves the donator from having to switch characters while buying selling stuff with zeny.

I usually keep donation related updates on the side until I have some spare time, or I'll explicitly make a goal of finishing a specific set of non-paid content before starting on it. My philosophy has always been server first, money...somewhere not first. I'll talk to a few people about the Discount/Overcharge idea, it might be a good addition to the VIP system since it fits the general idea of account-based convenience.

 

4 hours ago, peekaboo said:

So does everyone just use poring coins to get bottles? There's a huge miss IMO because if you increase the mob spawn and drop rates for the items that require you to make the bottles (acid, poison, etc) you increase player engagement automatically. 

I did actually consider this, but most SHR players prefer being able to buy their supplies for the most part (especially since a lot of them play multiple classes that need supplies), and it was a good opportunity to give some of the currencies some extra repeat value if they're used to restock from time to time.

 

4 hours ago, peekaboo said:

Servers don't run on TLC .. It requires hard work and getting no thanks and constantly complaining players .. It requires $$ unless you have a inheritance or something .. I'm not saying that make it a cash grab server just make it more appealing for people to willingly give you money .. Make them all costumes .. I'm just looking to make things reasonably easier for you because I've seen far too many good servers close because of lack of funds. Same thing happened on my last server because almost no donators and the owner could not keep up with the costs. 

A lot of people seem to forget that first part. =P I am somewhat used to it from my previous server though so it's not a big deal for the most part. As far as server income goes, we are looking at a few ways to get a bit more steady income to cover server/development costs, but if it does become a major concern I'll likely just start freelancing part-time again. It'd mean less time for updates, but the server would stay up that way at least.

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4 hours ago, Perry the Platypus said:

A lot of people seem to forget that first part. =P I am somewhat used to it from my previous server though so it's not a big deal for the most part. As far as server income goes, we are looking at a few ways to get a bit more steady income to cover server/development costs, but if it does become a major concern I'll likely just start freelancing part-time again. It'd mean less time for updates, but the server would stay up that way at least.

RL always and I mean ALWAYS > RO .. It's really great to see an owner/ admin take time to read/ respond rather than just glancing over and adding it to their "doesn't exist to do list" .. 

 

PS: Getting some GM's with coding experience will be really helpful .. Way better than 2-3 GM's logging in and doing the same things that a veteran player can .. Sorry I just don't think servers need more than 1-2 GM's spread across two timezones ..  

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9 minutes ago, peekaboo said:

RL always and I mean ALWAYS > RO .. It's really great to see an owner/ admin take time to read/ respond rather than just glancing over and adding it to their "doesn't exist to do list" ..

I will admit to being guilty of having a long to do list, but it does at least exist LOL.

 

11 minutes ago, peekaboo said:

PS: Getting some GM's with coding experience will be really helpful .. Way better than 2-3 GM's logging in and doing the same things that a veteran player can .. Sorry I just don't think servers need more than 1-2 GM's spread across two timezones ..

Having GMs available as often as possible is actually a pretty huge help to the server, especially when it comes to keeping newbies who are likely to have a lot of questions. Of course, the GMs are all volunteer, so we can't expect them to be online full time, which is why we have more than may seem necessary at first glance. Also, I somewhat disagree on it being something any veteran could do - while it may seem as simple as RO knowledge and activity, there's a lot of other factors as well, particularly trust (aka we try to avoid corruption as much as possible), reliability, and attitude/professionalism. Most servers don't seem to care about those things when hiring GMs, but I think that's one of the big reasons that a lot of servers die out within a few months.

 

As far as development, we do actually have another developer but he's currently busy with an internship. He'll hopefully be back to helping with updates again soon. :D Aside from that though it's surprisingly difficult to find decent devs in the RO community; most of them these days are very uh...questionable. And the ones that are good typically already have projects that they're busy with. I do keep an eye out for people who may be able to  help, though.

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2 hours ago, Perry the Platypus said:

I will admit to being guilty of having a long to do list, but it does at least exist LOL.

 

Having GMs available as often as possible is actually a pretty huge help to the server, especially when it comes to keeping newbies who are likely to have a lot of questions. Of course, the GMs are all volunteer, so we can't expect them to be online full time, which is why we have more than may seem necessary at first glance. Also, I somewhat disagree on it being something any veteran could do - while it may seem as simple as RO knowledge and activity, there's a lot of other factors as well, particularly trust (aka we try to avoid corruption as much as possible), reliability, and attitude/professionalism. Most servers don't seem to care about those things when hiring GMs, but I think that's one of the big reasons that a lot of servers die out within a few months.

 

As far as development, we do actually have another developer but he's currently busy with an internship. He'll hopefully be back to helping with updates again soon. :D Aside from that though it's surprisingly difficult to find decent devs in the RO community; most of them these days are very uh...questionable. And the ones that are good typically already have projects that they're busy with. I do keep an eye out for people who may be able to  help, though.

 Wow .. My last server awesome group of people and admins .. Lazy Ass owner (closed server to become PUBG pro), awesome dev with a shitty ass laptop that took ages to recompile code .. They were also our only GM's rest of the GM's just quit cause we would troll the f*** out of them .. I think this culture of GM's starts when there are too many customizations/ NPC's/ areas to administer .. I was so pleasantly surprised with the automated tour (BEST FEATURE IMO) because finding NPC's on a new server is always a shitty experience .. Apart from the donation queries this has to be one of the easier servers to get used to .. 

 

RO is an old game I'm surprised its still around for so long .. SEA's answer to WoW .. I'm pretty sure there's alot of stuff/ coding from Beta that still exists within all servers .. Coders have always been iffy unless you pay them well .. Even then its 50-50 depending on their ego .. 

 

Quick tip on easy Instance dungeon or custom dungeon .. Just use the existing  maps/ mobs that you have not yet implemented .. Edit drops > Make them 1-2 shot everything (Ignore Def/ Flee/ Resist) > Mandatory for all the mobs in the dungeon Reflect Shield/ Magic Mirror/ Warm Wind to keep changing elements .. 

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Glad you liked the newbie tour! We're hopefully going to expand on it in a later update with some custom "rookie quests" that'll serve as a guide for newbies who may not know where to go after leveling up. That and in-game wiki search functionality, which I'll be trying to patch in within the next week or two.

 

Sadly the main issue with modern RO developers is that they've seemingly forgotten what the word testing means. Mistakes happen, obviously, but some of the things I've seen with RO devs in the past few years have been the kind of things that can only happen if the testing phase was skipped altogether, never mind cutting corners with it.

 

The custom instances have specific plans already that make the existing maps unsuitable for them, but I also personally think that once we're ready to start developing those instances, using custom maps for them will be something that can really set us apart from other servers. Monster sprites will vary though; we'll probably end up using a mix of Renewal sprites and custom sprites, depending on the design of each instance. The MVPs will likely be similar in concept to our first custom MVP, King of the Abyss, but with increased difficulty and some custom skills/mechanics/AI to make the fights more interesting. :o

 

I'm also just now realizing that we're getting a bit off topic, so just to quickly recap on the topic itself:

New Set of Monthly Headgears: On hold atm due to needing designs for them, but they will be added in the future.

Healer Buffs: Would Blessing / Increase Agi / Impositio Manus be sufficient for this one, or did you (or anyone else) have other buffs in mind for it? Personally I think adding buffs to the Healer would be fine, but it would need to be discussed to make sure it doesn't end up being seen as unfair by other players (unfortunately perception plays a big part here).

Supply Box: I was thinking for this one, maybe we could just give one of each of the supply boxes that are currently available in the Donation Shop? Acid Bomb Box (2000), Poison Bottle Box (100), FCP Scroll Box (100), and Converter Box (100). They cost a total of 400 DCs from the shop, or ~106 Poring Coins (4 days worth of contracts). Could maybe add some Yggdrasil Berries in there for PvM players as well.

Discount/Overcharge: I think this one sounds like a good idea as a small convenience benefit. I'll talk to a couple others and see what they think about it as well.

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14 hours ago, Perry the Platypus said:

Sadly the main issue with modern RO developers is that they've seemingly forgotten what the word testing means. Mistakes happen, obviously, but some of the things I've seen with RO devs in the past few years have been the kind of things that can only happen if the testing phase was skipped altogether, never mind cutting corners with it.

 

This happens with all games nowadays .. Everything gets released like clockwork .. Players become Beta testers for a full price 60$ game .. 

 

14 hours ago, Perry the Platypus said:

The custom instances have specific plans already that make the existing maps unsuitable for them, but I also personally think that once we're ready to start developing those instances, using custom maps for them will be something that can really set us apart from other servers. Monster sprites will vary though; we'll probably end up using a mix of Renewal sprites and custom sprites, depending on the design of each instance. The MVPs will likely be similar in concept to our first custom MVP, King of the Abyss, but with increased difficulty and some custom skills/mechanics/AI to make the fights more interesting. :o

Make the mobs/ MVP with plant status .. GGWP .. Sorry I troll .. But yeah that would be super fun .. 

 

14 hours ago, Perry the Platypus said:

I'm also just now realizing that we're getting a bit off topic, so just to quickly recap on the topic itself:

New Set of Monthly Headgears: On hold atm due to needing designs for them, but they will be added in the future.

Healer Buffs: Would Blessing / Increase Agi / Impositio Manus be sufficient for this one, or did you (or anyone else) have other buffs in mind for it? Personally I think adding buffs to the Healer would be fine, but it would need to be discussed to make sure it doesn't end up being seen as unfair by other players (unfortunately perception plays a big part here).

Supply Box: I was thinking for this one, maybe we could just give one of each of the supply boxes that are currently available in the Donation Shop? Acid Bomb Box (2000), Poison Bottle Box (100), FCP Scroll Box (100), and Converter Box (100). They cost a total of 400 DCs from the shop, or ~106 Poring Coins (4 days worth of contracts). Could maybe add some Yggdrasil Berries in there for PvM players as well.

Discount/Overcharge: I think this one sounds like a good idea as a small convenience benefit. I'll talk to a couple others and see what they think about it as well.

 

HG's I'm not really concerned with cause its just cosmetic. I think it would be better to just give the player one HG of their choice from the donation list. This would reduce the blowback if they get a shitty HG from a box.

Buffs - I would suggest asking some of the PvP players if this would have an impact before implementing.

Supply Box - This call I leave upto you. I still think you should re think about increasing the mob spawns/ drop rates for the items that can be created (poison bottles, creator bottles, convertors, etc). There's so much huge potential than players dumping money into NPC's.

DC/ OC would be awesome as well.

 

I'm not sure how the title system works but are you able to add any title or just the default ones that are available. Allowing them to choose a title apart from the ones listed. 

 

Please don't respond to this topic or it will never end. Just close it. 

Edited by peekaboo

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I know you said not to reply, but I feel I should reply to at least a couple parts, especially since one of them was a question. =P I'll stick to just the topic itself though to avoid going too far off topic again (though you're more than welcome to open a new topic to discuss other ideas/questions, of course).

 

3 hours ago, peekaboo said:

think it would be better to just give the player one HG of their choice from the donation list. This would reduce the blowback if they get a shitty HG from a box.

This would somewhat reduce repeat value of the VIP accounts, since the random box may potentially be the reason a player gets it more than once (rather than just getting the headgear and never getting VIP status again). The new set of additional headgears would be a set like the January-December ones, though, so if players wanted a specific one they could wait for its month before buying VIP.

 

3 hours ago, peekaboo said:

I'm not sure how the title system works but are you able to add any title or just the default ones that are available. Allowing them to choose a title apart from the ones listed. 

The client pulls from a list of titles in the client data, and then gets a list of which ones are available to the player from the server upon login. So they couldn't set their own titles (that would defeat the purpose of achievement titles anyway), but we can add new titles to the list in future updates if we have some ideas for new ones. :o

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